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Closing in on 100 Ultramarathons

Submitted by Ean Jackson on 18 September, 2007 - 01:35.

One of my BHAGs (Big Hairy Audacious Goals) is to complete 100 ultramarathons during the year I enter the 50+ age group.

This post is a work in progress that I hope will keep me focused and allow me to know when I get there. The reason I say, "know when I get there" is because some folks are sticky about what constitutes an ultramarathon that should count in circumstances such as this.

I've got a ways to go, but I sure would like to celebrate when I get there. So, I will state my definition of what counts and list every ultra I've done that I think should qualify so any naysayers have lots of time to state their case. (You know who you are! =;-)

What counts and what doesn't:

event must be longer than the official 42.195 kilometer marathon distance
DNF's (Did Not Finish) don't count. It doesn't matter if 99 kilometers was actually run. If that distance was run in a 100-kilometer race, it don't count!
only recognized events count, not long training runs. A "recognized" event means it was organized and had at least 2 people in it
pacing doesn't count. It has to be an event you are registered for and are doing a set ultra distance in

Is this an "official" definition? Not necessarily. Ryne Melcher and I came up with this definition a few years ago when we were both closing in on 100 ultras. (Ryne, by the way, scooped me and has now run over 100. He keeps a log of who is getting close to this number on his website. It's a fairly short list =;-)

Jackson's List of Ultramarathon Runs

Here are the ultras I have run. Where possible, I've tried to link to the event results pages so those who care can verify my my claims. Where I ran an ultra, but didn't count it in the "official" count, I noted it for my own benefit. (e.g. 02(a) below where I was a pacer.)

Date Name of Event Time Pos/Field No.

1990

01. 14 Nov ULTRAMAN HI 40:14 / 661

1991

02. 13 Jul KKNSTR 50K 6:26:3 17 / 99 #1618

02(a) 28 Jun Western States 100 (pacer for 64k)

03. 09 Aug Earth Journey 24:45:40 6 / 16 #12 (10K, 420K, 84K)

1992

04. 22 Mar Sri Chimnoy 50M 6:31:22 1 / 19 67

05. 27 Jun Western States 100 22:09 25 / 425 195

06. 11 Jul KKNSTR 50K 5:51:08 8 / 99 4840

1993

07. 21 Mar Sri Chimnoy 50M 6:29:34 1 / 21 348

08. 01 May Elk/Beaver 100K 8:55:37 1 / 14 442

09. 05 Jun Great Walk 62.5k 5:15: 1 / 320 1971

(did it both ways) 15:58:40

09(a) 26 Jun Western States 100 (pacer for 64k)

10. 10 Jul KKNSTR 50K 5:41:01 8 / 99 6519

11. 8 Aug IAU Torhout 100K 7:56:.. .. / ... ...

1994

12. 01 Jan Fat Ass 50 5:..:21 / 11 n/a

13. 20 Mar Sri Chimnoy 50M 6:46.44 1 / 23 334

14. 26 Mar Chuckanut 50K .:..:.. . / ?? ,..

15. ?? .,. Great Walk 62.5k 4:58:14 1 / ?? 433

16. 09 Jul KKNSTR 50K 5:46:19 9 / ?? 124

17. 30 Jul ULTRAMAN Can 22:50:16 3 / 14 ,..

3:12:32, 11:47:36,

18. 31 Aug Harriers 100K 7:52:17 7 / 40

1995

19. 29 Jul Swiss Alpine .:..:.. . / ?? ,..

19(a) 01 Jul Trans Swiss (run) .:..:.. . / ?? (pacer)

20. 16 Sept Winschoten 100K 7:58:27 . / ?? ,..

1996

21. 01 Jan Fat Ass 50K .:..:.. . / ?? ,..

22. 17 Mar Sri Chinmoy 50m 4:04:04 n/a 241

23. 30 Mar. Chuckanut 50K 4:37:34 1 / 46

23(a) 22 Apr. Sun Run 50K KineSys :..:.. . / ?? 22826

24. 13 Jul KKNSTR 50K 6:04:39 14/ ?? 57

25. 28 Jul Kettle Valley 50K 3:52:.. 1 / 12 ,..

26. ?? .,. Burke Mtn 50K .:..:.. . / ?? ,..

1997

27. 01 Jan Fat Ass 50K .:..:.. . / ?? ,..

28. 12 Apr Diez Vista 50K 5:21:28 5 / 48 430

29. 26 Apr Sri Chimnoy 24Hr 8:54 1 / ?? 739

30. 24 May Sulphur Springs 50K 3:57:20 1 / 62 2523

31. 12 Jul KKNSTR 50K 6:40:54 42/ 146 123

32. ?? Aug White River 50m 7:52:41 2 / 79 66

33. ?? sep Winschoten 100K 7:35:?? ??/ ?? 256

34. ?? Oct Slough Despond 50K .:..:.. . / ?? ,..

1998

35. 11 Jul KKNSTR 50K 6:03:11 23/160

36. 06 Sept Walk in Park 50K 4:51:21 1 / 36 148

37. 12 Oct. 100K Japan 9:31:06 42 / ?? 22

1999

38. 01 Jan Fat Ass 50 4:54:?? 3 / ?? ,..

39. 23 Jan Nisene Marks 50K 4:22:?? 4 / 56 ,..
Santa Cruz, CA

40. 10 Apr Diez Vista 50K 5:26:?? 11 / 75 25

41. 10 Jul KKNSTR 50K 6:39:23 25 / 154 2132

2000

42. 08 Jul KKNSTR 50K 7:41:42 90 / 172

2001

43. 01 Jan Fat Ass 50 4:43:20 2 / 31

44. 17 Mar Chuckanut 50K 4:57:27 13 / 160

45. 14 Apr Diez Vista 50K 5:11:59 12 / 133

46. 14 Jul KKNSTR 50K 5:49:38 9 / 180

47. 28 Jul White River 50M 7:51:39 38 / 157

48. 11 Aug STORMY 67K 5:53:21 2 / 23

49. 02 Sep Walk in Park 50K 4:46:40 1 / 42

50. 30 Sep Silvertip 50K 4:43:05 2 /42

2002

51. 1 Jan Fat Ass 50k 5:45:?? 2 / 18

52. 16 Feb Dirty Duo 50k 4:25:10 5 / 18

53. 13 Apr Diez Vista 50K 5:20:28 9 / 117

54. 04 May Elk/Beaver 100K 8:21:53 3 / 15

55. 08 Jun Larch Hills 50K 4:01:?? 2 / ??

56. 13 Jul KKNSTR 50K 6:07:16 21 / 151

57. 10 Aug STORMY 67K 6:11:59 3 / 58

58. 01 Sep Walk in Park 50K 5:04:34 2 / 33

59. 28 Sep Silvertip 50K 4:32:01 3 / ?

60. 30 Nov Seward Park 50K 3:51:40 1 / 3

2003

61. 01 Jan Fat Ass 50k 5:05 7 / 66

62. 01 Mar Dirty Duo 50k 4:13:24 5 / 26

63. 12 Apr XTC 50K 5:14 2 / 17

64. 03 May Elk/Beaver 100K 8:54:38 3 / 17

65. 01 Jun Enduro 6-hour 6:

66. 12 Jul KKNSTR 50K 6:09:55 21 / 163

67. Forbidden Forest 45K 4:15:?? n/a

68. 09 Aug STORMY 67K 5:32:05 6 / 68

68(A) 00 Aug Sunshine Coast Trail Run(82K)

69. 27 Sep Silvertip 50K 4:36:37 3 / 48

70. 11 Sep Mountain Hwy Madness (45K) 4:15:37

2004

71. 01 Jan Fat Ass 50k

72. 06 Mar Dirty Duo 50k 5:16:59 5/46

73. 21 Mar Mountain Highway Madness 4:40 3 laps

74. 22 May Enduro 6-hour 5:59 – 17 laps 2/10

75. 12 Jun XTC 50K 5:50 2/6

76. 03 Jul Sunshine Coast Trail 180 43:50 1

77. 10 Jul KKNSTR 50K 6:02:08 20/201

78. 14 Aug STORMY 67K 7:08:18 24/59

79. 11 Sep Mountain Hwy Madness (45K)

2005

Injured. =:-(

2006

80. 08 Jul Knee Knacker 50K 8:28:18 148 / 203

81. 12 Aug STORMY 64K 7:54:

82. 19 Aug Forbidden Forest Run 5:30

83. 2 Sep Juan de Fuca Trail Run 8:00

2007

84. 01 Jan Vancouver New Years Day FA50 5:06

85. 17 Mar Chuckanut 50K 5:26:16 56 / 260

86. 07 Apr Diez Vista 50K 5:54:19 48 / 125

87. 12 May North Shore Enduro 6-hour 5:07:51

88. 07 Jun XTC 6:41

89. 14 Jul KneeKnacker 50K 6:45:29 56/209

90. 11 Aug STORMY 50M 8:27:55 9/73

91. 2 Sep Walk in the Park 54K 6:?? 6/??

92. 15 Sep Stein Valley Adventure Run 18:??

93. 20 Oct Grand Canyon Rim-2-Rim-2-Rim 15:??

94. 8 Dec Forbidden Forest Run 6:15

2008

95. 01 Jan Vancouver New Years Day FA50 5:06

96. 12 Jul KneeKnacker 50K 8:09:40 17/27

97.

98.

99.

100. woo hoo!

Ean Jackson's blog
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Comments

How many ultras?

Submitted by Gilles Barbeau on 20 September, 2007 - 10:14.

Just an idea, why don't we have a compilation chart on the CFA with the numbers of marathons/ultras like we see on Rune and June website or Marathon Maniacs?

Do you want to take that list on, Gilles?

Submitted by Sibylle Tinsel on 21 September, 2007 - 11:27.

Hi Gilles,

Would you like to take that list on? Are you envisoning a list that just counts or a more detailed list?

I think a count page would be nice and anybody who wnat to be more specific can do a blog post similiar to Ean's with a detailed compilation. I can attach those blog posts to the main list, so one can easily navigate to a blog page to see details.

Let me know and I'll set it up.

Cheers

Sibylle

Race list

Submitted by Gilles Barbeau on 21 September, 2007 - 11:52.

I'm not sure if it realistic for one person to maintain that list unless you're willing to devote a lot of time to the cause, which to be brutally honest, I'm not. You probably know more about that than I do. First I will talk to All Harman, I think he's the man. The way it works at Marathon Maniacs is that every member can update their own list. That's when All comes in, I think he has some expertise on the matter. I don't know what's involved in maintaining a detailed list of each events but we could certainly start with something that tracks year to date and lifetime number of CFA events, marathons and ultras. Here's how it looks like at MM for the list of all members; http://mm.littlemarathon.com/Scorecard.asp?Sort=4 Here's how it looks like for a specific individual, me; http://mm.littlemarathon.com/MyMarathons.asp?ManiacId=542

Lot's of work, yes!

Submitted by Sibylle Tinsel on 21 September, 2007 - 13:35.

Yes, A lot of stats work and maintenance on that one. I can provide the web space, but cannot do the stats.

Any ideas are welcome. Glenn, you can put your list in a blog post like Jackson, that way you won't loose it ;-)

I like the idea of a chart

Submitted by mudrunner on 21 September, 2007 - 08:24.

I like the idea of a chart or something...perhaps it's my personal disorganization, but I seem to make a list & lose it...as the years go by, I forget about some events (probably the same gene that allows me to sign up for 100's 'cause I "remember" how fun they are).

What counts as an ultra

Submitted by Gilles Barbeau on 18 September, 2007 - 09:53.

Ean, isn't the spirit of CFA events that you actually do custom distances. For example, the Vancouver 100, if someone complete 75k, wouldn't you count that as an ultra? I know you wouldn't at WS for example but under the spirit of CFA...

Ultra Count

Submitted by Ean Jackson on 18 January, 2008 - 10:44.

Hey Gilles,

Somehow I missed your note. Good question, though.

In the "rules" that Ryne and I proposed for what counts as an ultra, we attempted to establish international guidelines rather than guidelines for Club Fat Ass. This so that those who give a rat's ass about their ultra count will be able to substantiate their claims to their peers.

For example, Ryne Melcher and I have a beer bet on to see who is first to complete 100 ultras. He says he beats me and I owe him a cool one. My natural reaction is to say, "Hooey, prove it!" So we have to agree on the rules of what counts. In truth, both Ryne and I are CFA members and we have consumed far more beers together discussing the rules than we have discussing the winner! Apart from yourself, I don't think anyone else cares. That said, let's have a beer and discuss the rules one day soon as I think you might just kick my ass and beat me to 100!

I ramble. To answer your specific question, according to my interpretation of the "rules", if I set out to run 75K as a custom distance in a CFA event and I ran 75K (the distance I set out to run), yes, I would count it as long as I wasn't the only one in the run. To take that one step further, I'd also say that if you enter a 25K run with a "custom" category and you run 50K, that should count. Would you agree?

One fine morning at 3:00 am, my buddy Paul Quinn and I ran from my place in Kitsilano to the start of the Vancouver Sun Run (5K.) We ran the Sun Run (10K) from start to finish, turned around and ran from finish to start (10K). We repeated that (20K) then ran the actual Sun Run (10K) before running home (5K). Now there were no GPSs to document our distance, but lets call it 60K. We were both officially registered in the Sun Run. We both ran an ultra distance. Because we were entered in a 10K that didn't offer a "custom" distance, I noted it in my training log, didn't count it.

Anyway, are you proposing a beer bet to beat me to 100 ultras? Bring it on, dude! =;-)

What counts?

Submitted by Gilles Barbeau on 18 January, 2008 - 20:41.

Yes, that Sun Run thing was a training run not an ultra to add to the list and I like the looser rules of CFA.

To further enrich the discussion you might want to check out what is the Marathon Maniacs take on it.

http://www.marathonmaniacs.com/faq_criteria.html

It's been discussed in length over there as well. My argument is that it's my list and I dam well going to decide what I'll add on. On the other hand you and everybody else for that matter, will decide weather I'm credible or not. For example if Mr. Shoeless Hopalong runs a marathon every Saturday on the treadmill in his basement and decides to add to his list then goody for him. No, it doesn't make sense for Shoeless to get credit for his training runs and yes it would be somewhat unfair for the rest of us but if he's adamant that he should claims some fame for his weekly training runs then what the hell? Again credibility, I think we can quickly establish that Shoeless Hopalong is a doofus who needs attention and who knows, may be the affection and tenderness that we can provide as a running group would prevent him from committing a horrible crime.

Here we go again with the beer bet Monkey Boy. I think tomorrow will be #59 for me but I got 39 marathons as well so I'm closing in on #100 marathons/ultras. Give me something to work with silly dude.

Very Impressive

Submitted by Geoffrey Palmer on 11 August, 2006 - 10:01.

Hey Ean

That is a very impressive list. I've had the discussion many times with people about the definition an ultramarathon. I have a couple of questions that I haven't been able to answer.

1. How do you count Stage Races? Back in Manitoba we have what's called the Mantario Marathon. 63 km trail done over 2 days (plus you have to sleep under the stars that night). No ultra is done in any one day, but overall it is more than a marathon. If that doesn't count, in longer stage races, do people get credit for several ultras? For example, I'm not too sure about the specs of Dom's run, but I'm pretty sure he ran more than 42.2 on more than one day. Is that still one ultra or more?

2. Distance: How tight does the distance measuring have to be? If you ask a marathoner how many he or she has done, you can be very sure that they were all (or at least for the most part) exactly 42.2. The ultra measurements are far less precise (from my understanding, the dirty duo 50k has never actually been 50k!). I know that the Fluffy Bunny distances are just guesses. Maybe the full distance is more than 42.2 km. You certainly have to spend the same amount of energy as an ultra! In some races, how can you be sure you have done more than 42.2? In most cases, there is no question that 42.2 kms have been covered, but there might be some that are close. For example, I'm 95% sure than a loop on Mountain Highway is not 15 km. In fact, I think it's closer to 13km (check it out on gmap-pedometer.com is you don't believe me). Also, has anyone actually be able to measure the Forbidden Forest Run?

3. What is a training run? Sometimes it is not obvious what the difference between a training run and a race is. For example, had we covered more than 42.2 last Sept in Squamish, would that have been an ultra or a training run?

Anyway, these are the philosophical questions that I ponder on long runs! By the strictest standards, I'm at 10 ultras. Depending on how you answer the questions above, I can get away with 14.

By the way I noticed that Ron Adams wasn't on the website you posted; he must be getting close to 100 as well.

Geoff

As far as verifying

Submitted by mudrunner on 21 September, 2007 - 08:49.

As far as verifying distances, I would go by what the officially stated race description calls it. I know that Dirty Duo has changed routes almost every year...& perhaps there was a year that was "short"...but for the most part, it's shaving it pretty close. Hey, even the venerable Western States was "short" for a few years, but I wouldn't discredit anyone's claim to covering 100 miles. I compare trail runners to mountaineers where claims are based on genleman's trust.

What counts as an ultra?

Submitted by Ean Jackson on 11 August, 2006 - 11:46.

Hey Geoff,

I can see you understand what I mean by "what counts as an ultra?" now! In the end, I figure you count what you you want because it's your log. It just gets complicated when you're zoning in on a number like 100 because then you have scrutiny from outside.

Some thoughts from my perspective:

1. Stage races. I count them as one, because the event you are registering for is one event. For it to count as an ultra, I'd say you have to run more than 42.2K at a stretch. In other words, if it is a 200K stage race over 3 days with 100K, 75K and 25K, that would count as 1. If it was a 100K stage race with ~35K per day, it ain't no ultra!

2. Measurement. Good point. Who can say with absolute certainty that an ultra is truly an ultra? For my count, I go on what the organizer says it is and trust that (s)he knows. Since I host the Forbidden Forest and Mountain Highway Madness, I can confirm that I can not state with absolute certainly that the posted distances are exact. I do try to get a close measurement and always state how I arrived at the distance in the FAQ section. (e.g. "guesstimated based on trail maps, used a Nike Tailwind pedometer or a Garmin GPS...)

3. Training Run. I figure his isn't that tough to test. If it has a brochure or a website, if it is posted in a race calendar, if the results are posted and distributed then I consider it to be "organized." If one person shows up, I'd call it a training run, where if 2 or more show up, then it's an event that counts. I wanted to count our Squmish Scrambler escapade as an ultra for my list, but the organizer told me he figured we didn't cover the distance. (Let's beat up on Robbins to remeasure that one 'cause I swear that was more than 42K!!)